Lively is a wonderful environment for experimenting. Of course this depends on what you want to achieve but in my experience you are able to do quite complex things pretty fast.<div><br></div><div>Take this demo for example:</div> <div> result: <a href="http://lively-kernel.org/other/fuelDemoVideo1.mov">http://lively-kernel.org/other/fuelDemoVideo1.mov</a></div><div> building it with wiring parts together: <a href="http://lively-kernel.org/other/fuelDemoVideo2.mov">http://lively-kernel.org/other/fuelDemoVideo2.mov</a></div> <div><br></div><div>It is a rough visualization of a how a car driving along a given path that highlights the fuel stations the car can reach with its fuel level that changes as it drives along.</div><div><br></div><div>(The purpose of the demo was mainly to show how such a visualization can be created using a mix of graphical/textual programming and combining existing components, not the actual application itself)</div> <div><br></div><div>Creating the initial sketch (that was really running of course) was something that two people (that were very familiar with the system) did in the course of three hours. Pretty fast I guess. Tweaking things to look nicer and embedding ideas that came up in the process of building it took 2-3 days more.</div> <div><br></div><div>For the purpose of creating this interactive demo, Lively worked very well. However, important to mention is that this was *just a demo*. The application that came out of it not usable in the sense of a software product as you have to be careful of where to click etc. So a lot of issues related to the usability of the interface from the standpoint of an end-user were not addressed. Producing something like a "demo to be used by others" will definitely require *much* more time.</div> <div><br></div><div>Also consider that Lively / Webwerkstatt is used as a research environment as opposed to a stable development environment like Eclipse. Things look rough. Interfaces change. Tools evolve. We are currently working on a version of Lively that is more stable than what you find in Webwerkstatt (see the other messages on this list), however, we are not able to give any support guarantees.</div> <div><br></div><div>I agree with Jens, take a couple of hours time and try to dig in the system and produce at least a tiny part of what you have in mind and see if this feels right.</div><div><br></div><div>I would love to see a new system build in/with Lively :)</div> <div><br></div><div>Robert</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Sep 10, 2012 at 8:12 AM, Jens Lincke <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jens.lincke@hpi.uni-potsdam.de" target="_blank">jens.lincke@hpi.uni-potsdam.de</a>></span> wrote:<br> <blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div bgcolor="#FFFFFF"><div>Hi Chip,</div><div><br></div><div>did you play with it for 2 hours you to try it out, or what are your experiences yet? It depends what kind of demo app is required... A mobile app? </div> <div><br></div><div>I think you could try, but be aware that it can be easy if you do similar things others have been done, but it can get messy when you want to go where no one has gone before you in lively ;-)</div><div> <br></div><div>Best,</div><div>Jens</div><div><br></div><div>Am 10.09.2012 um 15:59 schrieb Chip Nowacek <<a href="mailto:chip@twostewards.com" target="_blank">chip@twostewards.com</a>>:<br><br></div><div><div class="h5"> <div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div>Should I take the silence as: "Stay away from Lively" ?<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: <b class="gmail_sendername">Chip Nowacek</b> <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:chip@twostewards.com" target="_blank">chip@twostewards.com</a>></span><br> Date: Thu, Aug 30, 2012 at 6:11 PM<br>Subject: LK ready for prototyping?<br>To: The Lively Kernel Mailing List <<a href="mailto:lively-kernel@hpi.uni-potsdam.de" target="_blank">lively-kernel@hpi.uni-potsdam.de</a>><br> <br><br>Hello,<div> <br></div><div>I'm sure I am less than 1/10th the programmer of the least on this list. I hope you'll forgive the my rather lowly skill set.</div><div><br></div><div>That said, I have a desperate need to create a demo app for investors and production developers. In your estimation, is LK ready for that type of work? I will ask about production readiness later.</div> <div><br></div><div>While I'm asking, anyone interested in helping out with (what I think will be) an important application with long legs? The domain model, 4 years in the works, is pretty stable. It needs a compelling, highly-interactive front end (thus the LK question). In broad terms, I am looking to build a cognitive tool that deals with human relationships. It'll also need a mobile app at some point.</div> <div><br></div><div>Thank you humbly,</div><div><br></div><div>Chip</div> </div><br> </div></blockquote></div></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><span>_______________________________________________</span><br><span>lively-kernel mailing list</span><br><span><a href="mailto:lively-kernel@hpi.uni-potsdam.de" target="_blank">lively-kernel@hpi.uni-potsdam.de</a></span><br> <span><a href="http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel" target="_blank">http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel</a></span><br></div></blockquote></div><br>_______________________________________________<br> lively-kernel mailing list<br> <a href="mailto:lively-kernel@hpi.uni-potsdam.de">lively-kernel@hpi.uni-potsdam.de</a><br> <a href="http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel" target="_blank">http://lists.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/listinfo/lively-kernel</a><br> <br></blockquote></div><br></div>